tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5053151003977377665.post5150680361936353764..comments2024-02-23T05:11:31.034-08:00Comments on Always Formative: SBG Implementation: Topic ScalesJason Buellhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03029995715142652159noreply@blogger.comBlogger24125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5053151003977377665.post-28107661384458435662012-06-21T23:48:49.025-07:002012-06-21T23:48:49.025-07:00I like the low to mid level descriptions...I have ...I like the low to mid level descriptions...I have to go think about that.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00871914277608831247noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5053151003977377665.post-37434474228891212592012-06-21T23:39:20.610-07:002012-06-21T23:39:20.610-07:00I'm basically doing it by unit. I had original...I'm basically doing it by unit. I had originally planned to organize it by the 11 California language standards, but they are not topical and I feel that they communicate an EXTREMELY vague message to parents and students, which is the same way I'd think of separating it into the four language domains. Right now I've set it up in two parallel grade-books. In one of them I have the units, named by essential question. In the other I have the skills. The first quarter has three units in the standards side and about 12 skills on the skills side. I'd like to keep track of assignments as well, not for credit but rather to see what kind of effort they're putting in. When you're saying "low-level" and "mid-level" are you equating that to your 2.0 and 3.0?Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00871914277608831247noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5053151003977377665.post-17162251799199078582012-06-19T23:38:48.734-07:002012-06-19T23:38:48.734-07:00Sorry, I'm not 100% sure what your'e askin...Sorry, I'm not 100% sure what your'e asking here. Are you asking whether to keep in vocab or grammar? <br /><br />For foreign language I've seen it done a bunch of different ways. One I saw separated into listening/speaking/reading/writing with subdomains within each one. I've also seen it just separated by (I guess it was probably traditional units) but it was more like...Language for greetings, language for travel, language in daily life, etc. The low level stuff would be the vocab and basic conjugations. Mid-level would be the basic back and forth sentences and higher would be the natural conversational or academic fluency.<br /><br />Basically: It doesn't matter how you do it, what matters is that it's designed in a way that makes sense for you and your students and that you can take actions (as a teacher or student) based on your level of proficiency at each standard.Jason Buellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03029995715142652159noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5053151003977377665.post-10287253101251357092012-06-19T23:17:56.908-07:002012-06-19T23:17:56.908-07:00You mean like something in a 2.0 overlapping with ...You mean like something in a 2.0 overlapping with a 3.0 or across topics? For the first, yeah. They should to a degree. If I was a graphic designer I probably could make it more like a bubble diagram with the main 3.0 topic as the main bubble and the 2.0 stuff coming off the main bubble. I don't know if that made any sense. But you know me so ask for more.Jason Buellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03029995715142652159noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5053151003977377665.post-23180543668901044692012-06-19T16:58:23.665-07:002012-06-19T16:58:23.665-07:00I'm a Spanish teacher, and out of deep disgust...I'm a Spanish teacher, and out of deep disgust with participation grades and grades that don't tell students what they need to do to improve I've decided to jettison my current grading scale in favor of topics. I'm still a little torn between the skills list and topics. One of the main reasons for this is that we do teach copious amounts of vocabulary, and we do it every four weeks or so. An ameliorating factor is that we have pedagogy that works for that, in most cases--it's the focus of what we do. That said, I find that my students have more trouble understanding what's weak in their work from a standpoint of exact skills, and that grammatical accuracy is one of the most difficult things for them. A lot of people in my field think that it's not a skill that we should demand of the students, but I disagree. I think that there is a mathematical element to language, and we call it grammar. It's lazy to say that students can't devote some of their time and attention to that. Having a simple skills list would show them explicitly where to focus that attention. I have 38 skills on my list. If I do it by topic, I'll have 11 topics that contain 4-6 smaller skills each. It's almost like keeping the connections increases the number of things that students need to be able to do. The list probably contains redundancies as in foreign language much of what we do depends upon mountains of repetition. To leave out or to keep in?Profe. Necoecheahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13385190523695108750noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5053151003977377665.post-27691767407047216442011-12-15T11:24:02.218-08:002011-12-15T11:24:02.218-08:00Do you find that your 2-level stuff overlaps betwe...Do you find that your 2-level stuff overlaps between standards? I.e. that for two standards in the same topic, you find yourself repeating things in your 2 list? Does this foreshadow trouble down the road?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5053151003977377665.post-17208285804272185372011-09-11T12:14:14.676-07:002011-09-11T12:14:14.676-07:00Working on implementing this in my SS classroom th...Working on implementing this in my SS classroom this year. My students look a LOT like yours except we're 98% F&R and 75% Hispanic, so I think it's going to work. Initial feedback from the kids is positive. I'm grouping 'topics' as "essential questions" - big ideas the kids need to know. Having just written the test for the first unit (Colonial), I'm finding it's still too "big" so I'm working on how to refine it. I'll keep you updated and share if I get anything I think is ground-breaking for those SS teachers out there who want to try this. Thanks for the site - it's helping me get it tailored to my content.Kellihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10141942386988135329noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5053151003977377665.post-6056504877044485282011-08-22T21:41:39.851-07:002011-08-22T21:41:39.851-07:00I had just written about how I was feeling frustra...I had just written about how I was feeling frustrated trying to work with and develop standards, and I'm glad I came across this - it was exactly what I needed! I've been following your blog but hadn't yet taken the time to look back through the SBG archive. So thanks!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5053151003977377665.post-25245247608534692602011-01-06T19:57:38.800-08:002011-01-06T19:57:38.800-08:00Your welcome. Take take take. That's what it&#...Your welcome. Take take take. That's what it's here for. I've stolen everything else, gotta pay it forward. Funny you should comment. Your blog just popped up in my google reader yesterday. "Electronics teachers in Canada who blog" is a pretty lonely category. Good luck and keep me updated.Jason Buellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03029995715142652159noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5053151003977377665.post-26616636089896126212011-01-06T18:49:17.597-08:002011-01-06T18:49:17.597-08:00Hello, just a quick note to say thanks! I lifted ...Hello, just a quick note to say thanks! I lifted nearly your whole system for my courses this semester. I get the logic behind the "topic-based" approach. Also, I was determined to make this transition over the winter holiday (because I am insane). The fact that you had collected and organized all this information into such a digestible format really made that possible. I look forward to stealing whatever you come up with next :)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5053151003977377665.post-71538460718637650832010-07-24T15:16:57.709-07:002010-07-24T15:16:57.709-07:00continued because blogger doesn't like big com...continued because blogger doesn't like big comments:<br /><br /><br />So if I were you Deep Space might be the topic name. The essential questions might be what you use to link them all together.The stuff you have listed as Big Ideas I'd consider those my targets to learn the topic (3.0). From there you have to work backwards to create the 2.0. <br /><br />For example basic knowledge of the redshift might be considered 2.0, but using that to be able to explain how that is evidence for an expanding universe is 3.0. It really depends on your goals though so don't take that example as canon.<br /><br />As for cutting standards, it looks like you're an NY teacher. In talking with a few other teachers I know from NY, you've got tons of standards and your tests are arbitrary so it's up to you how much you want to cut. I can only speak for myself but I at least feel much more like a teacher having focused deeply on a few major concepts rather than racing for coverage. <br /><br />Come back and comment, find me on twitter, or email whenever you need to talk again.Jason Buellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03029995715142652159noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5053151003977377665.post-75906432423212574672010-07-24T15:16:34.225-07:002010-07-24T15:16:34.225-07:00Might be difficult in a comment, feel free to emai...Might be difficult in a comment, feel free to email me if you need more info. <br /><br />One big caveat: There's no SBG canon. I'll comment on what I've done in my class. <br /><br />First I should point out that I use a different model than most people. I don't use a straight skills checklist, I group them into topics. The topics are based around a few big ideas. Those big ideas are further broken down into separate content/skills they'll need to get the big ideas. If it helps to picture, I often start by writing out a main idea (my 3.0 score), and then creating a tree diagram with the stuff they'll need to know to get there below it (2.0). <br /><br />What really helps is to just look at your tests/labs/projects and see what you're trying to get at. The goal is the 3. Always start there and work backwards.<br /><br />1. In my actual electronic gradebook, I only report out by topic.<br />I have students just traffic light the individual standards. Two reasons 1. I usually don't need fine grain detail for each standard to set my lessons. 2. Individually tracking each standard seems crazy and I'm not hyper organized as it is. <br /><br />2.It looks like you've actually done the work unpacking your standards already. You've separated out your big ideas and created a learning progression for your students. Usually I think of topics as equal to traditional units but that's not always the case. Some topics will be ongoing throughout the year and embedded in other things, like Scientific Thinking kinds of topics.Jason Buellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03029995715142652159noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5053151003977377665.post-56692032355475228262010-07-24T15:15:55.293-07:002010-07-24T15:15:55.293-07:00Might be difficult in a comment, feel free to emai...Might be difficult in a comment, feel free to email me if you need more info. <br /><br />One big caveat: There's no SBG canon. I'll comment on what I've done in my class. <br /><br />First I should point out that I use a different model than most people. I don't use a straight skills checklist, I group them into topics. The topics are based around a few big ideas. Those big ideas are further broken down into separate content/skills they'll need to get the big ideas. If it helps to picture, I often start by writing out a main idea (my 3.0 score), and then creating a tree diagram with the stuff they'll need to know to get there below it (2.0). <br /><br />What really helps is to just look at your tests/labs/projects and see what you're trying to get at. The goal is the 3. Always start there and work backwards.<br /><br />1. In my actual electronic gradebook, I only report out by topic.<br />I have students just traffic light the individual standards. Two reasons 1. I usually don't need fine grain detail for each standard to set my lessons. 2. Individually tracking each standard seems crazy and I'm not hyper organized as it is. <br /><br />2.It looks like you've actually done the work unpacking your standards already. You've separated out your big ideas and created a learning progression for your students. Usually I think of topics as equal to traditional units but that's not always the case. Some topics will be ongoing throughout the year and embedded in other things, like Scientific Thinking kinds of topics.<br /><br />So if I were you Deep Space might be the topic name. The essential questions might be what you use to link them all together.The stuff you have listed as Big Ideas I'd consider those my targets to learn the topic (3.0). From there you have to work backwards to create the 2.0. <br /><br />For example basic knowledge of the redshift might be considered 2.0, but using that to be able to explain how that is evidence for an expanding universe is 3.0. It really depends on your goals though so don't take that example as canon.<br /><br />As for cutting standards, it looks like you're an NY teacher. In talking with a few other teachers I know from NY, you've got tons of standards and your tests are arbitrary so it's up to you how much you want to cut. I can only speak for myself but I at least feel much more like a teacher having focused deeply on a few major concepts rather than racing for coverage. <br /><br />Come back and comment, find me on twitter, or email whenever you need to talk again.Jason Buellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03029995715142652159noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5053151003977377665.post-1013062973077942982010-07-24T10:57:19.487-07:002010-07-24T10:57:19.487-07:00Hi, Thanks so much for the blog post. IT is exte...Hi, Thanks so much for the blog post. IT is extermely helpful!! This is something I really want to try this year. I teach earth science and am really struggling with what the standards are - are they the standards - too many of them, are they objectives (students will be able to), are they the unit topics? science skills (observing, hypothesizing)? What would go into my gradebook?? <br /><br />Thanks so much for any guidance. I am excited about this, but a little stuck...I would greatly appreciate any advice or discussion you have.<br /><br />I am including links to a couple documents...<br /><br />https://docs.google.com/document/edit?id=1cAtCar5rObsh817CFDeIehaKeavf8t-Itnse9vVolyY&hl=en&authkey=CJ_6w80B (probably more helpful AFTER the first page or 2, more into the content<br /><br />and <br /><br />https://docs.google.com/fileview?id=1jiUqBHZznif8tZcuS182mpesZL-LEeXDfz5Im1b2apmLgm-uFYMmFBltX-m6&hl=en&authkey=CKXD77IC (a broader chart I tried to use last year)Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09162617854252443574noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5053151003977377665.post-20160438413273740482010-07-15T11:44:28.281-07:002010-07-15T11:44:28.281-07:00Thanks Mark. You're one of the trailblazers he...Thanks Mark. You're one of the trailblazers here. Your site if fantastic. <br /><br />Attention my six readers: Go to eightfalls.com right now.Jason Buellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03029995715142652159noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5053151003977377665.post-50481354808560887122010-07-08T08:40:21.368-07:002010-07-08T08:40:21.368-07:00It is really encouraging to see teachers moving aw...It is really encouraging to see teachers moving away from grading heavily dependent upon percentages. Furthermore, you are differentiating your grading based on cognitive levels - Awesome! <br /><br />Have to admit ... your scoring system looks super fantastic - especially for the younger students. <br /><br />Love the Backward Design approach you have going down ... don't forget those Essential Questions to lead to the Bid Ideas :D<br /><br />Awesome conceptual examples! Thanks for including the Math example!Mark Olsonhttp://eightfalls.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5053151003977377665.post-46774384775759084342010-06-02T21:22:52.577-07:002010-06-02T21:22:52.577-07:00@Mrs. Schroder. Welcome fellow SBGer! I've sub...@Mrs. Schroder. Welcome fellow SBGer! I've subscribed to your blog. Keep me updated on your progress. I didn't see if you had a twitter handle from your blog but if I don't follow you already I'd like to.<br /><br />You definitely want to use your state standards only as a starting point. A few are just right but mostly they're too broad or super specific. I do a lot of breaking down and lumping together.<br /><br />Astronomy is one of the strands in our 8th grade physical science curriculum. It's like...6 weeks of stuff. Most of the year is devoted to intro physics and intro chem.<br /><br />Now to your question:<br />My astronomy topic is the bane of my life. I’m still going to put most of the blame on my less than stellar astronomy knowledge, but my state standards aren’t helping the matter. As they’re written and as the state tests them, they can basically be taught as a series of vocabulary flashcards (What's a planet? What's a meteor? What's an AU?). For my other topics I usually aim for half a step up from the state requirements. For astronomy I think I’ve got to move higher to make it meaningful at all. I'm having trouble with the wording so if you can help me out that'd be great: <br /><br />Big idea: Multiple lines of evidence are used to discover objects in the universe and determine their properties. 3.0 – Explain how the composition of stars is determined, how planets are discovered, how the orbit of celestial objects is determined, etc. 2.0 would be the various facts. So in order to understand how planets are discovered and why they’re so hard to find, you’d need to understand that planets only reflect light, they're smaller, etc. I don’t know though. It's basically a series of disconnected facts. I need Phil Plait or Neil Tyson to let me know what to do here.<br /><br />I'm hoping if I design the topic this way I can teach students to think like an astronomer rather than the facts of astronomy; which is probably closer to how I teach phys and chem as well.Jason Buellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03029995715142652159noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5053151003977377665.post-84276459113786727052010-06-02T09:25:49.952-07:002010-06-02T09:25:49.952-07:00You teach Astronomy? I am struggling laying out my...You teach Astronomy? I am struggling laying out my standards with that class as well. I started out with our state standards and found the targets to be simply too vague. Then I swung too far the other way and ended way too specific. The ideas themselves don't build on each other quite as neatly as chemistry and physics.Tracie Schroederhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10237663751076265379noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5053151003977377665.post-66047215534666117202010-05-31T22:29:25.356-07:002010-05-31T22:29:25.356-07:00@AtlTeacher = Thank you for commenting. Keep me up...@AtlTeacher = Thank you for commenting. Keep me updated on your progress with SBG. <br /><br />The gradebook post is a three posts from now but I would generally recommend the big umbrella standards vs. 96 skills in the gradebook. Again, context matters here but I can't imagine my kids looking at 96 different skills and feeling anything but overwhelmed. I've found it helpful to add a comment to a grade like "Still needs to work on calculating density." <br /><br />I'm going to bring up a separate issue though. Your umbrella standards clearly need to be regrouped to be useful.<br />Example:<br /><i>ELA10W1 The student produces narrative, expository, persuasive, and technical writing that establishes an appropriate organizational structure, sets a context, engages the reader, maintains a coherent focus throughout, and signals closure. </i><br /><br />My ELA teachers spend a significant amount of time on each style. I think the different types of writing deserve their own topic. <br /><br />On the other hand, I might combine the "demonstrate a comprehensive grasp of significant ideas in literary works" standard into the separate writing styles since it looks like the first standard addresses form of a writing style while the second addresses content. Again, my ELA knowledge isn't great so feel free to ignore me. However, you should definitely regroup them in ways that make sense for your teaching.Jason Buellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03029995715142652159noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5053151003977377665.post-86643918088413246392010-05-31T09:41:17.354-07:002010-05-31T09:41:17.354-07:00I did a version of SBG for the first time this sch...I did a version of SBG for the first time this school year and I'm spending this summer trying to sharpen it. I have 12 big umbrella standards and 96 specific skills under those standards. Which should I put in the gradebook? I've listed the standards and skills here: http://www.chambleemiller.com/standards.htmlAtlTeacherhttp://forcuriousteachers.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5053151003977377665.post-45980451751497798952010-05-29T22:09:34.375-07:002010-05-29T22:09:34.375-07:00Thanks glsr, Matt, and Kate. I hope it was helpful...Thanks glsr, Matt, and Kate. I hope it was helpful in some ways, even though you're the advanced class.<br /><br />@Matt - Good teaser. I've already subscribed so I'm waiting for the update. As for your comment, I agree, but I waffle on how much I should be nudging my colleagues forward. I've pointed out a few times that I think Dan Meyer's system is more of a hybrid SBG and trad system. A lot of people start with his system because his blog is so highly trafficked (and rightly so). I don't want to discourage the people who think that they've made a huge step, but at the same time I don't want them to think they're done-or that I'm done for that matter. Summary: I agree but have a hard time finding that balance of encouragement and prodding.<br /><br /><br />@Kate - Thanks. I've had this post percolating for awhile but was angsty about writing stuff for non-science subjects. BTW, by my count I've commented on your blog three times today, you one time on mine, plus twitter. We've got to stop meeting like this or people will talk.Jason Buellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03029995715142652159noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5053151003977377665.post-43229756647014654412010-05-29T19:23:11.841-07:002010-05-29T19:23:11.841-07:00You did a good job with the math example.You did a good job with the math example.Katehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14229054922453438248noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5053151003977377665.post-57467056348658427182010-05-29T14:24:10.455-07:002010-05-29T14:24:10.455-07:00Jason, I really like how your post not only lays o...Jason, I really like how your post not only lays out <b>what</b> you're doing, but also the <b>order</b> in which it makes sense for a person to start from scratch. I'll need to make a new tag or something to keep this post ready to share with others.<br /><br />I have a bone to pick with part of your post. :)<br />The sentence that ended with.."there are three more teachers (7th math, 6th math/sci, 7th ELA) that have adopted certain aspects of SBG." <br />In an upcoming With Students in Mind podcast (how's that for a teaser?!), Shawn suggests that you're either doing SBG or you aren't and I think I agree. We should still support those who are only putting one foot in the circle, I'm wondering if we should also give them some sort of new, fun and/or interesting name....SBGers in training or something. Testing out SBG for the sake of eventually going all out is laudable, but dabbling with no intention of moving forward is a step sideways in my opinion.<br /><br />I also REALLY like your 0-4 scale narratives. If I were teaching again next year, I think I would go away from using both edu- and student-jargon and move towards something like yours that is easy for adolescents to understand.<br /><br />Keep posting about your journey. I'm learning along with you.Matt Townsleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15247211425347677596noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5053151003977377665.post-54307837776383376932010-05-29T11:37:53.887-07:002010-05-29T11:37:53.887-07:00Awesome, inspiring and extremely helpful post, Jas...Awesome, inspiring and extremely helpful post, Jason. You're getting the highest compliment I give: I'm printing it out to re-read at the park!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com